cha ching

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Posts by cha ching

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  9

  Trey is still on top of it!

  by cha ching in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  there is still a chance that the watchtower files zalkin received, will surface again in the future!

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  https://www.revealnews.org/blog/jehovahs-witness-abuse-files-remain-secret-after-court-settlements/.

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  cha ching

  There is still a chance that the Watchtower files Zalkin received, will surface again in the future!

  https://www.revealnews.org/blog/jehovahs-witness-abuse-files-remain-secret-after-court-settlements/
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  23

  Why did you leave?

  by Fred Franztone in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we all have many reasons for leaving, most are doctrinal, some are emotional.

  it's a religion which obsesses over factual proofs (counterfactual though they are) of its veracity rather than faith, so it's inevitable that most who leave will do so for intellectual reasons.

  which doctrine above all others forced you to reconsider your position?

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  cha ching

  Magnum... It was the October 2011 (Pages 26-31) & November 2011 WT (pgs 22-28)...

  The specific quote, about the Business tablets, was:

  *** w11 11/1 PAGE 23 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part Two ***
  ● Business tablets.
  What are they? Most business tablets from the Neo-Babylonian period are legal receipts. The tablets were dated to the day, month, and year of the reigning king. For example, one tablet states that a transaction took place on “Nisan, the 27th day, the 11th year of Nebuchadrezzar [also known as Nebuchadnezzar II], king of Babylon.”4
  *** w11 11/1 PAGE 25 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part Two ***
  Nebuchadnezzar II destroyed Jerusalem in his 18th regnal year.—Jeremiah 32:1.
  If the 37th year of Nebuchadnezzar II was 568 B.C.E., then Jerusalem was destroyed in 587 B.C.E.
  *** w11 11/1 PAGE 24 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part Two ***

  Business tablets exist for all the years traditionally attributed to the Neo-Babylonian kings. When the years that these kings ruled are totaled and a calculation is made back from the last Neo-Babylonian king, Nabonidus, the date reached for the destruction of Jerusalem is 587 B.C.E. However, this method of dating works only if each king followed the other in the same year, without any breaks in between.

  They throw this piece of STUPIDITY in here to make you question yourself... "Was there another king in here?" "Could there have been?" Really, the WT just asks "how many months were overlapping?" "could this mean?" .... and even if the kings overlapped by months, so what!? It comes no where CLOSE to the 20 year difference, remember that!

  We also have to realize that ALL of the dates WT gets are from...... ta ta da dahhhhh.... the same sources they want you to question! They USE cuneiform tablets, etc... and wow, as long as they can "work it" to go with their ideas... they use it! See?
  

  *** w11 10/1 PAGE 28 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part One ***
  A PIVOTAL DATE IN HISTORY
  The date 539 B.C.E. when Cyrus II conquered Babylon is calculated using the testimony of:
  ▪ Ancient historical sources and cuneiform tablets: Diodorus of Sicily (c. 80-20 B.C.E.) wrote that Cyrus became king of Persia in “the opening year of the Fifty-fifth Olympiad.” (Historical Library, Book IX, 21) That year was 560 B.C.E. The Greek historian Herodotus (c. 485-425 B.C.E.) stated that Cyrus was killed “after he had reigned twenty-nine years,” which would put his death during his 30th year, in 530 B.C.E. (Histories, Book I, Clio, 214) Cuneiform tablets show that Cyrus ruled Babylon for nine years before his death. Thus, nine years prior to his death in 530 B.C.E. takes us back to 539 B.C.E. as the year Cyrus conquered Babylon.
  Confirmation by a cuneiform tablet: A Babylonian astronomical clay tablet (BM 33066) confirms the date of Cyrus’ death in 530 B.C.E. Though this tablet contains some errors regarding the astronomical positions, it contains the descriptions of two lunar eclipses that the tablet says occurred in the seventh year of Cambyses II, the son and successor of Cyrus. These are identified with lunar eclipses visible at Babylon on July 16, 523 B.C.E., and on January 10, 522 B.C.E., thus pointing to the spring of 523 B.C.E. as the beginning of Cambyses’ seventh year. That would make his first regnal year 529 B.C.E. So Cyrus’ last year would have been 530 B.C.E., making 539 B.C.E. his first year of ruling Babylon.
  [Credit Line] Tablet: © The Trustees of the British Museum

  However, the box on page 31 says:

  *** w11 10/1 PAGE 31 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part One ***
  A QUICK SUMMARY
  ▪ Secular historians usually say that Jerusalem was destroyed in 587 B.C.E.
  ▪ Bible chronology strongly indicates that the destruction occurred in 607 B.C.E.
  ▪ Secular historians mainly base their conclusions on the writings of classical historians and on the canon of Ptolemy.
  ▪ The writings of classical historians contain significant errors and are not always consistent with the records on clay tablets.

  The WT will praise and use a source as if it was written by God on one hand: "hey, it supports our ideas!"... and condemns them as soon as it doesn't! And that, my friend is why we all felt crazy!
  cha ching! cha ching! WT ain't gettin' no more of my bling!
  
  
  
  
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  23

  Why did you leave?

  by Fred Franztone in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  we all have many reasons for leaving, most are doctrinal, some are emotional.

  it's a religion which obsesses over factual proofs (counterfactual though they are) of its veracity rather than faith, so it's inevitable that most who leave will do so for intellectual reasons.

  which doctrine above all others forced you to reconsider your position?

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  cha ching

  The two WT articles in 2011 about 587 vs 607.

  (The bold and italicized words are from me)

  *** w11 10/1 p. 31 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part One ***
  A QUICK SUMMARY
  ▪ Secular historians usually say that Jerusalem was destroyed in 587 B.C.E.
  ▪ Bible chronology strongly indicates that the destruction occurred in 607 B.C.E.
  ▪ Secular historians mainly base their conclusions on the writings of classical historians and on the canon of Ptolemy.
  ▪ The writings of classical historians contain significant errors and are not always consistent with the records on clay tablets.

  WT is very clever to use these words, and does so consistently. A month later (in "Part 2" of the 'series) WT again takes up its "slight of hand", "slight of words" tricks, throwing questions here and there to distract you, and says:
  *** w11 11/1 When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?—Part Two ***Note: None of the secular experts quoted in this article hold that Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 B.C.E.An accession year was not counted toward the years of a king’s rule; it referred to the remaining months of the year until the new king was officially enthroned.Business tablets exist for all the years traditionally attributed to the Neo-Babylonian kings. When the years that these kings ruled are totaled and a calculation is made back from the last Neo-Babylonian king, Nabonidus, the date reached for the destruction of Jerusalem is 587 B.C.E.
  Then WT dishonestly throws in:
  However, this method of dating works only if each king followed the other in the same year, without any breaks in between.
  Not only did the actual evidence of business tablets for EACH year make me mad, and realize they lied, but the way WT uses distractions to throw you off track that there is evidence for EACH year!
  

  " Even if an eclipse did occur on a certain date, does this mean ..?" "But do these astronomical references irrefutably point only to the year 568/567 B.C.E.?" "However, there was also..." "If these are retrocalculations, could they really be considered absolutely reliable unless corroborated by other evidence?" "Could others have ruled between the reigns of these kings? If so, additional years would have to be added to the Neo-Babylonian period."

  
  (me: This means the BIBLE left out names of Babylonian kings... that means you can't trust the Bible either) ......................

  
  "The Babylonian Chronicles" What do the documents show? There are gaps in the history recorded in the Babylonian chronicles.3 (See the box below.) Logically, then, the question arises, How reliable are deductions based on such an incomplete record?

  
  (Remember, WT knows there are business tablets for every year of every king, but because there are not enough "Chronicles" they want you to think all is lost, all is "incomplete"...)
  

  "▪ Some writings of classical historians contain significant errors and are not always consistent with the records on clay tablets."

  Don't forget, that "some" "Historical writings" have errors... why use those when you have business tablets for EACH year of EVERY king... WT is consistent in throwing you off guard, distracting you from reality.
  

  "Instead of saying 70 years “at Babylon,” many translations read “for Babylon""

  Blah, blah, blah "at" vs. "for", right!??!!
  Remember, WT is just throwing out questions that they ultimately do not answer... these are just to make you question and stop considering the actual facts.
  In my opinion? Very clever, very deceitful, very maddening! Hasta la vista, baby! and I am NOT looking back!
  
  
  
  
  
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  45

  Padron Case Settled. What happens to the fine?

  by Slidin Fast in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  it seems that irwin zalkin has obtained undisclosed settlement in the case.

  the $4000 a day fine then seems to be dead.

  the downside?

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  cha ching

  The Watchtower has done its best to fight turning over documents that would show the scope of sexual abuse by elders. The final blow came last year when an appellate court affirmed a lower court's decision to fine the Watchtower $4000 a day for not turning over documents to the victim's lawyers.

  In January, Watchtower settled with Lopez. One month later, on February 18, the church settled with Campos’s final victim Padron.

  Attorney Irwin Zalkin confirmed the settlement. The amount, however, will remain confidential.
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  9

  NaijaNews Article: Here Are Seven Beliefs That Make Jehovah Witness Different From Other Christians

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  [the link states "six beliefs" but the title mentions "seven beliefs.

  " looks like someone goofed!

  here are seven beliefs that make jehovah witness different from other christians.

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  cha ching

  I am glad that the "news" about JWs is getting spread, and wondered about the 'style' of this writing... it seems disjointed, and almost like a rough Google translation. It sounded a bit 'African' And then I looked up the source....

  Naija News is the name of the newspaper... Naija is a new slang word for Nigeria...

  http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-11447252

  "The word was coined by the country's youth as a way of distancing themselves from the old guard”
  "What Naija means to me is: Nai - the old Nigeria with a bad image because of corrupt ex-leaders and Ja - a slang for disappear. So when we say Naija, it means that we, the youth, are determined to cleanse the country and show the world the true colour of this great nation. Naija for real."

  With that in mind, I say "Go Naija!" Expose these JWs for who they really are! Every movement begins with a feeling, and this article helps us see how ex-JWs feel. "no house" "no education" "shunned" "pedophiles not brought to justice" "beaten" "family lost due to 'no blood rules'"

  I love their picture!

  "Hey Watchtower!" "We still have voices!" A picture says a thousand words. Go Naija!
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  11

  Priming the Pump

  by days of future passed in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the definition of priming the pump, is put to water manually into the casing of the pump so that it will create a seal and draw the water up.

  it's a term used for economics but i like to use it when i am trying to hopefully help a jw, escape.

  i view it as a long term endeavor.. whenever there are videos for upcoming conventions, i'll try to work the main theme into a conversation with them.

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  cha ching

  I have spoken to a few ex-JWs this last year, and one common thing I heard from them was "something someone said stuck in my head.... and then I heard another.... and then..'

  When the final straw fell, and the weight of the evidence added up, they were grateful for that first person, and the second, as now they are glad to be awake. They do not want to support such a greedy, unloving, user borganiztion.
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  26

  They are all dead!

  by Sour Grapes in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the watchtower company and the jdubs talk so nonchalantly about the year 1914, the year they say jesus became king in the heavenly kingdom.

  they talk about the year like it was just a short time ago.

  the invisible king began ruling in the invisible kingdom.

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  cha ching

  One time I sat down and counted all the generations that were listed in either Matthew Mark Luke or John can't remember now, took all the years and divided them by that number. It came out pretty close to 40.

  Jerusalem was destroyed in less than 40 years. That generation and many other Generations in the Bible were about 40 years.

  F...O...R...T...Y...
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  30

  Marriage Proposal in the Kingdom Hall

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  just when you think you've seen it all comes another interesting use of a kingdom hall.a young man serenades his girlfriend with a song (possibly a watchtower song) from the stage through a microphone and backed by recorded music.

  then he steps off the stage and gets down on one knee and proposes as he pulls out a ring from his coat pocket.

  the large projector screen flashes up behind them with a picture of a sapphire and diamond ring.cameras capture the joyous moment as she accepts and they lock together in a loving hug.

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  cha ching

  Yep Diogenesister I noticed the ring exchange too! I think they may have gotten married! Plus, They played the regular wedding bells music afterwards!
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  27

  Solicitors Appontment Tomorrow - Advice Appreciated

  by pale.emperor in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  following up on this thread: https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5012900121935872/am-overreacting-here?page=3#!#5179106934128640.

  im seeing my solicitor tomorrow to see about getting an order in place making sure any contact my daughter has with my jw family goes through me and not my ex-wife.. explained the situation briefly to the lawyer, she was asking more and more about why should i be concerned if a jw had access to my child.. i mentioned the blood issue, the shunning, the inappropriate pictures of armageddon in books/mags etc.

  do you think i should bring in watchtower literature to show them what i mean?

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  cha ching

  Show the video where the mom gets a phone call from a DF'd daughter, looks at her husband, and sets the phone down. The girl looks sad, and wonders why they won't answer.
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  17

  Winning The Battle For Your Mind Watchtower 7/15/2017

  by Brokeback Watchtower in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  you are under attack!

  and your chief enemy, satan, is using a very dangerous weapon against you.

  propaganda!

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  cha ching

  I hear the same phrases come out of so many JWs all the time, like a printing press/ copy machine, the words roll off their tongue: "nobody's perfect, we know our leaders are not perfect"